Hey all,
I was wondering who has had experience "bending" the rules regarding the rear number plates? I'm having a great deal of difficulty trying to get three 5's to line up. How stringent are the tech inspectors regarding the 1" apart and 1" inside the edge rule ?
5.3.6 Numbers must be black and approximately 8" high and 1" wide, of
standard block lettering with no shading, outlining or serifs. Number must
be spaced approximately 1" from each other as well as the edge of the
plate or display area. 6" numbers may be used on the rear plates. All
numbers on any display must be the same size.
5.3.9 Final approval of number display will rest with the Race Director.
Thanks much!
I had mine about 3/8 of an inch apart. Friend did the same on his and got bitched at for it.
I think it has a lot to do with being legible. Of course that is a subjective item many times.
Quote from: roadracer22 on February 07, 2008, 11:12:23 AM
Of course that is a subjective item many times.
Friends was legible. Just was that the "tech guy", and I use that term loosely, knew that this bike was such and such's bike the year before and decided to nit pick on everything. Even said the CCS sticker was crooked.
I will admit I dont think I ever had 1 inch between my numbers on my bike my first year racing. I had a 3 digit number and there was no way to get that much room between each number and fit it on the tail, or the front for that matter.
I never got one word said to me about my numbers.
It could all come down to the tech guy. Just hope he is having a good day.... :cheers:
Mine were never that far apart when I had a 3-digit number, mine were maybe 1/2" at most. now with a 2 digit I'm at about 3/4" apart.
Quote from: Woofentino Pugrossi on February 07, 2008, 01:41:41 PM
Friends was legible. Just was that the "tech guy", and I use that term loosely, knew that this bike was such and such's bike the year before and decided to nit pick on everything. Even said the CCS sticker was crooked.
...gee what "tech guy" might you be talking about :lmao: :lmao: :lmao:
Quote from: Jason748 on February 07, 2008, 07:38:13 PM
...gee what "tech guy" might you be talking about :lmao: :lmao: :lmao:
I think you know which one. :lmao:
Feel free to state for the record that you're not talking about me. :kissy:
Quote from: Burt Munro on February 08, 2008, 02:04:19 AM
Feel free to state for the record that you're not talking about me. :kissy:
We dont consider you tech, just one a grid bitch.:biggrin:
Whatchu talkin' 'bout Willis?
Quote from: Burt Munro on February 08, 2008, 02:04:19 AM
Feel free to state for the record that you're not talking about me. :kissy:
Course they're not talking bout you. I think you are the only tech guy I have ever had at BHF that actually looked at my motorcycle. It was re-assuring.
It all comes down to the person teching your bike/bikes that day. And depending on weather your on the shit list or not. Newer guys just starting out are usually going to sit in tech few minutes longer. Also the cleaner your bike the less time they have to spend looking for issues..I have gone through different techs with different bikes - weather it's CCS/ WERA/AMA/USGPRU or Moto-st - sometimes you just get people that don't really know what to look for or don't care. And sometimes you get guys that are really good - and that's a good thing - sometimes they find something you missed.. But conversely I have gone through CCS tech with mailbox numbers on my tail section(06R6) - and I've taped a stuffed parott to my tail section and gotten through an AMA tech without a problem.....
Quote from: Burt Munro on February 08, 2008, 02:04:19 AM
Feel free to state for the record that you're not talking about me. :kissy:
I actaully try and get you when I go thru tech. :biggrin: becuase of what both Scotty& Ben said. :thumb:
Quote from: Jason748 on February 08, 2008, 11:31:40 AM
I actaully try and get you when I go thru tech. :biggrin: becuase of what both Scotty& Ben said. :thumb:
Oh...I don't know that Weaver is soooo great. :err:
PIT RIGHT NEXT TO TECH...and just because Lonny opens his big mouth...Rick makes me roll the bike forward 3 feet. :wah:
:biggrin:
Cut the crap, you'll ruin my reputation! :ass:
What Scotty says, is unfortunately true.
Riders become predictable and earn a reputation. You bring a bike thru Tech that shows the attention to detail that you've put into it, it makes it a lot easier on everyone. I'm not talking about bling or a cool paint job or exotic number plates - but a higher level of maintenance.
That's not to say that it gives you a free pass. Just that it makes it easier to check the stuff we need to look for.
Unfortunately people earn opposite reputations too. Bikes that look like they're held together with duct tape, chewing gum and zip ties get lots of attention ! And usually display lots of shortcuts or trying to skim the rules.
If you're a new guy or we haven't got to know you very well yet, don't be offended when we don't take your word that the drain plug is safety wired. Not that we take the word of people we've known for years. It's all about making sure someone doesn't go down on the track from something that can be avoided.
Remember that regardless of the type of bike you ride, if the safety wire on the drain plug, filter and oil fill plug can't be easily seen, the bike needs to come to tech with the belly pan off. One thing that helps is if you wrap a short piece of fluorescent orange or yellow tape around the safety wire to make it stand out.
Number plates are another issue. Just because it looks cool sitting on the stand at 0 mph doesn't mean that the starter, scorers and cornerworkers can read it when you fly by at 120 +. We all know that it's getting tougher and tougher to work around the limited amount of nose and tail space you've got. Best bet is if you can't easily read your numbers from 100 feet away, you're most likely going to have a problem at Tech.
Rick,
Are you saying I need to replace my duct tape, chewing gum and zip ties on my bikes
That would leave more stuff for you to pick up off the track for me when I do my daily lap. :biggrin:
And I dont think I can see my bike from 100 ft let alone the numberplate
Does this look correct to you tech guys?
IMG]http://i254.photobucket
(https://www.ccsforum.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi254.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fhh104%2F2old2fat2slow%2FTheRaceTeam004.jpg&hash=e24924889d0292192c592c0618f49757fb5d9d34)
(https://www.ccsforum.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi254.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fhh104%2F2old2fat2slow%2FTheRaceTeam006.jpg&hash=e422eb53b348b4f607816c0930daa4bd4fced805)
(https://www.ccsforum.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi254.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fhh104%2F2old2fat2slow%2FTheRaceTeam005.jpg&hash=bb2b4cdb91546f88f903479d6df253d52feef51b)
(https://www.ccsforum.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi254.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fhh104%2F2old2fat2slow%2FTheRaceTeam001.jpg&hash=1fd4d03a32e5a885418ff90110c4aae023eda975)
Quote from: backMARKr on February 08, 2008, 11:42:02 AM
Oh...I don't know that Weaver is soooo great. :err:
PIT RIGHT NEXT TO TECH...and just because Lonny opens his big mouth...Rick makes me roll the bike forward 3 feet. :wah:
:biggrin:
Do you blame him... Poor Rick has to deal with the three of you :ahhh: I think he should have made you push the bike to the back of the longestest line :biggrin:
Quote from: Jason748 on February 11, 2008, 11:02:01 AM
Do you blame him... Poor Rick has to deal with the three of you :ahhh: I think he should have made you push the bike to the back of the longestest line :biggrin:
:err:
:kissy:
Quote from: SCOTTY727 on February 08, 2008, 10:09:41 AM
It all comes down to the person teching your bike/bikes that day. And depending on weather your on the shit list or not. Newer guys just starting out are usually going to sit in tech few minutes longer. Also the cleaner your bike the less time they have to spend looking for issues..I have gone through different techs with different bikes - weather it's CCS/ WERA/AMA/USGPRU or Moto-st - sometimes you just get people that don't really know what to look for or don't care. And sometimes you get guys that are really good - and that's a good thing - sometimes they find something you missed.. But conversely I have gone through CCS tech with mailbox numbers on my tail section(06R6) - and I've taped a stuffed parott to my tail section and gotten through an AMA tech without a problem.....
This is exactly my experience at tech. For example, last week at Homestead the tech guy who looked at my numbers gave me a rash of crap. He said that the numbers don't look like those in the book, but ironically, I followed the rules EXACTLY. For example, I used Arial Narrow Bold, 8" front and 6" rear, just like the book, and he insisted that they didn't look like those in the book. I was in a rush and didn't have time to apply the numbers quite so nicely.
Yet on another occassion, I used a different font with different size numbers (so they'd fit better on my bike) on a different bike, but they were applied very nicely. I sailed through tech with the same guy!
The point is, use a font that's easy to read, not too fancy or anything like that, that fits properly, and it will usually not raise any eyebrows during tech. A sloppy number job, even if technically accurate, will likely receive their scrutiny. I find that Gill Sans MT in Bold works well, is easy to apply and very easily readable.
Quote from: Burt Munro on February 08, 2008, 02:12:58 PM
Remember that regardless of the type of bike you ride, if the safety wire on the drain plug, filter and oil fill plug can't be easily seen, the bike needs to come to tech with the belly pan off. One thing that helps is if you wrap a short piece of fluorescent orange or yellow tape around the safety wire to make it stand out.
Thanks for the tip on the fluorescent tape on the safety wire.
I would try my best to get everything right before going to tech. Tech isn't consistant from region to region. I found the SE to be much more difficult then the MA. At Daytona I had three different tech officials yelling at me for different things all at the same time, I had to interrupt them and remind them they would all have equal chance to yell at me but I can't understand any of them.
I had the first 2006 R6 through tech at Daytona in 2006 and they were giving me poop about the number plate not being on the side properly and telling me I would need plates like the vintage bikes to pass tech. Another guy was yelling about my numbers being to close together and the third guy was yelling about my bike not being exactly in the right spot. very fustrating.
Then later in that same year at Barber, I had crashed and needed fresh bodywork. The painter I guess painted the number plates with a little neon color in it. As I pulled up to tech, the tech marshal started yelling, "don't you even think of bringing that bike on my tech line", I turned around looking for the poor sap he was talking about. Then the guy yelled, "you know I'm talking about you", I turned around again wondering where this guy was and what his problem was. Then he yelled a third time, "stop turning around I'm talking to you". Finally I pointed to myself and said yes you. I didn't see the number plates as being anything but yellow and there are several MA guys who used the same painter with the same yellow and never had a problem. But I had to run to a trackside vendor and buy yellow duct tape and numbers to refit my bike so I could race.
Sucked, moral of the story get it 100 percent right the first time.
I skated through tech all season at all '07 events.
yes I had all different techs do my bike Including L. multiple times
yes I had NON conforming Yellow for my plates
yes I had my lowers taken off half the time
yes I rolled up and let Tech Do what they Do and didn't make excuses
and most of all showed respect the entire way
and I was let though every time based on what all else was written in this here thread. So read close and do your thing, let them do theirs {it's their right} and enjoy your race weekend!
(https://www.ccsforum.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.1000rr.us%2Fgntbldr%2Fpics%2F07CCS%2FIMG_6891.JPG&hash=12fae470314394ed60b4d028a9c5ab851a2875da)
Ya know Jim you just made yourself a target for Burt in tech. :lmao:
Quote from: Woofentino Pugrossi on February 16, 2008, 01:27:56 AM
Ya know Jim you just made yourself a target for Burt in tech. :lmao:
Nah.... Larry's the one who likes to shoot fish in a barrel!
I'm the one who has to get down on the ground and do all the dirty work trying to help the poor schmuck who has his lowers riveted onto his GSXR! :biggrin:
Quote from: Z-man on February 15, 2008, 11:57:03 AM
The painter I guess painted the number plates with a little neon color in it.
I was gonna paint my plates in flourescent yellow (I swear I read that it is suggested somewhere...) and looking back at the rule book, I can't find anything prohibiting it... what ground do they have to stand on? Isn't any shade/tone of yellow, still yellow?
Yellow has no adjectives or combinations, flourescent yellow is not yellow, neither is yellow blue (ie Green) or yellow red (orange) extremes I know but yellow is a primary color it has no other colors added to it or missing from it.
All the more reason to get to white plates. Move up you snadbaggers...
Mark
Quote from: Eric Kelcher on February 17, 2008, 07:04:05 PM
Yellow has no adjectives or combinations, flourescent yellow is not yellow, neither is yellow blue (ie Green) or yellow red (orange) extremes I know but yellow is a primary color it has no other colors added to it or missing from it.
This is too hard - can I move up to Expert so that I can have white plates?
Seriously, though...
...to say that yellow is a "primary color," is partially a true statement. It is a primary color in subtractive processes, such as four-part printing, where the primary colors are cyan, magenta, yellow, and black. In additive processes, such as projection (e.g., older CRT monitors/tv's) the primary colors are red, green blue - they create colors by projecting these three primary colors in different quantities. In the subtractive process, a pigment is used (some combination of the four primaries) to subract the undesired wavelengths of light. Definitions of "primary colors" are arbitrary, or perhaps a better word would be "relative," as the definition of primary depends on the object receiving or manipulating the wavelengths of light in question. For human eyes, there are 3 receptors, called "cone cells," which detect red, green, and blue. There is no property of light that makes colors primary or secondary - it's simply how the colors are defined by the object receiving or producing them.
So yellow is a primary color of the subtractive CMYK process, but it is actually a "pigment" since it works by NOT absorbing the wavelengths that our eyes perceive as yellow (and absorbing everything else). Since painting a fairing is applying a pigment, the important thing to note is that "yellow" can be defined as what we see from light of the wavelength between 570-580nm, or some appropriate other combination of other wavelengths, i.e., the only wavelengths that are NOT absorbed by the paint being used. That is the yellow defined as the primary color "yellow" in CMYK or four-part processes.
This is most often referred to as Process, Printer's, or Pigment Yellow. I believe that Canary Yellow is the colloquial nomenclature.
So yes, this is a long winded way of saying that Eric Kelcher is correct - when you paint your fairings, get a paint that corresponds with the above (or move up to Expert and use white). Get a basic, standard yellow, that eliminates all wavelengths other than 570-580nm :), i.e., Process/Painters/Pigment/Canary Yellow. Any body-shop or paint supply will know what to give you. If you use vinyl instead, same thing. The vinyl manufacturer's will know what is "true" yellow. And if you use paint, make sure to use enough coats so that whatever color is underneath doesn't modify the appearance of the yellow.
Like I said, I hope I make Expert this year...of course, then I'll have to decide between Egg Shell, Ivory, Cream, etc... :)
Sorry for the long-winded monologue.
Quote from: kl3640 on February 17, 2008, 08:27:08 PM
This is too hard - can I move up to Expert so that I can have white plates?
Seriously, though...
...to say that yellow is a "primary color," is partially a true statement. It is a primary color in subtractive processes, such as four-part printing, where the primary colors are cyan, magenta, yellow, and black. In additive processes, such as projection (e.g., older CRT monitors/tv's) the primary colors are red, green blue - they create colors by projecting these three primary colors in different quantities. In the subtractive process, a pigment is used (some combination of the four primaries) to subract the undesired wavelengths of light. Definitions of "primary colors" are arbitrary, or perhaps a better word would be "relative," as the definition of primary depends on the object receiving or manipulating the wavelengths of light in question. For human eyes, there are 3 receptors, called "cone cells," which detect red, green, and blue. There is no property of light that makes colors primary or secondary - it's simply how the colors are defined by the object receiving or producing them.
So yellow is a primary color of the subtractive CMYK process, but it is actually a "pigment" since it works by NOT absorbing the wavelengths that our eyes perceive as yellow (and absorbing everything else). Since painting a fairing is applying a pigment, the important thing to note is that "yellow" can be defined as what we see from light of the wavelength between 570-580nm, or some appropriate other combination of other wavelengths, i.e., the only wavelengths that are NOT absorbed by the paint being used. That is the yellow defined as the primary color "yellow" in CMYK or four-part processes.
This is most often referred to as Process, Printer's, or Pigment Yellow. I believe that Canary Yellow is the colloquial nomenclature.
So yes, this is a long winded way of saying that Eric Kelcher is correct - when you paint your fairings, get a paint that corresponds with the above (or move up to Expert and use white). Get a basic, standard yellow, that eliminates all wavelengths other than 570-580nm :), i.e., Process/Painters/Pigment/Canary Yellow. Any body-shop or paint supply will know what to give you. If you use vinyl instead, same thing. The vinyl manufacturer's will know what is "true" yellow. And if you use paint, make sure to use enough coats so that whatever color is underneath doesn't modify the appearance of the yellow.
Like I said, I hope I make Expert this year...of course, then I'll have to decide between Egg Shell, Ivory, Cream, etc... :)
Sorry for the long-winded monologue.
WOW, do we have a nomination process for best post??? LOL, that was awesom!
...so then, plain yellow it is I guess...
That was a post Carl Sagen,Steven Hawking, and Professor Irwin Corey would have been proud of.
Damn it... Now my head hurts - It's too late and I'm to tired!
Quote from: kl3640 on February 17, 2008, 08:27:08 PM
This is too hard - can I move up to Expert so that I can have white plates?
Seriously, though...
...to say that yellow is a "primary color," is partially a true statement. It is a primary color in subtractive processes, such as four-part printing, where the primary colors are cyan, magenta, yellow, and black. In additive processes, such as projection (e.g., older CRT monitors/tv's) the primary colors are red, green blue - they create colors by projecting these three primary colors in different quantities. In the subtractive process, a pigment is used (some combination of the four primaries) to subract the undesired wavelengths of light. Definitions of "primary colors" are arbitrary, or perhaps a better word would be "relative," as the definition of primary depends on the object receiving or manipulating the wavelengths of light in question. For human eyes, there are 3 receptors, called "cone cells," which detect red, green, and blue. There is no property of light that makes colors primary or secondary - it's simply how the colors are defined by the object receiving or producing them.
So yellow is a primary color of the subtractive CMYK process, but it is actually a "pigment" since it works by NOT absorbing the wavelengths that our eyes perceive as yellow (and absorbing everything else). Since painting a fairing is applying a pigment, the important thing to note is that "yellow" can be defined as what we see from light of the wavelength between 570-580nm, or some appropriate other combination of other wavelengths, i.e., the only wavelengths that are NOT absorbed by the paint being used. That is the yellow defined as the primary color "yellow" in CMYK or four-part processes.
This is most often referred to as Process, Printer's, or Pigment Yellow. I believe that Canary Yellow is the colloquial nomenclature.
So yes, this is a long winded way of saying that Eric Kelcher is correct - when you paint your fairings, get a paint that corresponds with the above (or move up to Expert and use white). Get a basic, standard yellow, that eliminates all wavelengths other than 570-580nm :), i.e., Process/Painters/Pigment/Canary Yellow. Any body-shop or paint supply will know what to give you. If you use vinyl instead, same thing. The vinyl manufacturer's will know what is "true" yellow. And if you use paint, make sure to use enough coats so that whatever color is underneath doesn't modify the appearance of the yellow.
Like I said, I hope I make Expert this year...of course, then I'll have to decide between Egg Shell, Ivory, Cream, etc... :)
Sorry for the long-winded monologue.
Can I get you to do my taxes?? :biggrin:
Quote from: 2old2fat2slow on February 17, 2008, 09:45:49 PM
That was a post Carl Sagen,Steven Hawking, and Professor Irwin Corey would have been proud of.
Nah, he never used photon, and he defined the light by wavelength rather than frequency.
Quote from: kl3640 on February 17, 2008, 08:27:08 PM...to say that yellow is a "primary color," is partially a true statement. It is a primary color in subtractive processes, such as four-part printing, where the primary colors are cyan, magenta, yellow, and black. In additive processes, such as projection (e.g., older CRT monitors/tv's) the primary colors are red, green blue - they create colors by projecting these three primary colors in different quantities. In the subtractive process, a pigment is used (some combination of the four primaries) to subract the undesired wavelengths of light. Definitions of "primary colors" are arbitrary, or perhaps a better word would be "relative," as the definition of primary depends on the object receiving or manipulating the wavelengths of light in question. For human eyes, there are 3 receptors, called "cone cells," which detect red, green, and blue. There is no property of light that makes colors primary or secondary - it's simply how the colors are defined by the object receiving or producing them.
So yellow is a primary color of the subtractive CMYK process, but it is actually a "pigment" since it works by NOT absorbing the wavelengths that our eyes perceive as yellow (and absorbing everything else). Since painting a fairing is applying a pigment, the important thing to note is that "yellow" can be defined as what we see from light of the wavelength between 570-580nm, or some appropriate other combination of other wavelengths, i.e., the only wavelengths that are NOT absorbed by the paint being used. That is the yellow defined as the primary color "yellow" in CMYK or four-part processes.
So yes, this is a long winded way of saying that Eric Kelcher is correct - when you paint your fairings, get a paint that corresponds with the above (or move up to Expert and use white). Get a basic, standard yellow, that eliminates all wavelengths other than 570-580nm :), i.e., Process/Painters/Pigment/Canary Yellow. Any body-shop or paint supply will know what to give you. If you use vinyl instead, same thing. The vinyl manufacturer's will know what is "true" yellow. And if you use paint, make sure to use enough coats so that whatever color is underneath doesn't modify the appearance of the yellow.
Also, all that above being said; There is no reference to how bright or dark, the amount of light reflected, the yellow is... :banghead:
Quote from: Noidly1 on April 10, 2008, 02:15:46 PM
Also, all that above being said; There is no reference to how bright or dark, the amount of light reflected, the yellow is... :banghead:
School bus yellow is always a safe choice. Problem is different people see colours differntly than others. What may look like a bright yellow to one, may be greenish to another.
Will this yellow be ok? The yellow is a "john deere yellow" (picture white balance sucked). I've got some 6" numbers to toss on there. My only concern is where the yellow\green split, will there be enough room for full numbers? Thanks.
(https://www.ccsforum.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fandrewgore.net%2Fwp-content%2Fgallery%2Fr6%2Ftail_section-752.jpg&hash=d648ea96154be0bbe7f70ea6f542ac98f9df5ef3)
Andrew
Looks fine to me. But its the tech guys that have the final say.
Cool. I figured it'd be as much. My main concern was with how the tail numbers would come out. I managed to squeeze 6" on there, and the 8" up front. Should I possibly add a main border around the numbers? Might define things a bit more?
http://andrewgore.net/wp-content/gallery/r6/IMG_5396-1504.jpg
Thanks,
Andrew
Quote from: andrewgore on April 11, 2008, 11:12:09 AM
Cool. I figured it'd be as much. My main concern was with how the tail numbers would come out. I managed to squeeze 6" on there, and the 8" up front. Should I possibly add a main border around the numbers? Might define things a bit more?
http://andrewgore.net/wp-content/gallery/r6/IMG_5396-1504.jpg
Thanks,
Andrew
According to CCS, you are allowed to use down to 4" IF the 6" #'s won't fit on your tail section; however, I don't know if a paint-scheme reducing the available area will count as a reason for using the smaller #'s.
I think that so long as the numbers are as large as possible, are applied neatly and clearly visibly, and the background is appropriate, you'll likely be OK during tech; but it is always at the discretion of the inspectors.