Let me preface this by saying I have been riding in the LW class for over 10 years on an Aprilla RS250, old Ducati 750S, Honda Hawk, SV650, and now Ducati 1000DS. I think it's time for some changes in the LW Class rules.
There are only two sportbikes currently produced that are legal for LW classes- the Suzuki SV650 and the Kawasaki Ninja 650. Both of these bikes are not very competitive from the factory and require modification to compete in anything other than Supersport, and even then with difficulty.
Ducati does not currently produce a bike that is competitive, only the Monster and Hypermotard fit the engine displacement limits and those are not suitable for racing.
Buell does not currently produce any LW eligible machinery.
Yamaha does not currently produce any LW eligible machinery.
Bimota does not currently produce any LW eligible machinery.
My point is that most bikes that are competing today in LW classes are past models that are highly modified for racing use. The most competitive is the Bimota which is a superbike chassis with a LW class engine and a $30,000 price tag. Far from entry level.
I know the debate about Ducati 748's has raged on here- and I agree that when built to the limit it is too fast for Lightweight. But what about limiting the 748 (NO RS MODEL) to Supersport mods and only in GP, GT, and SB? It's already allowed in Thuderbike so no problem there.
There are tons of these things cheap on ebay, and you can build one for about $3500 from parts.
As a second option, how about allowing larger machines to be resized for LW? They do this in WERA, it was pretty common to find de-stroked 748's that were 700CC and SV's that were de stroked to fit in the LW twins category. I think RRW did an article on these. Why is this banned in CCS?
Even one step further- why not allow different frame and engine combos for SB, and GT? I would love to put my 1000DS motor into my 996 chassis. As it is there are bikes riding around (I saw two this week alone) that have been heavily modified to accept the single sided rear swingarm from a monster or 748. This basically involves sawing the bike in half and is legal- why not just let us use the whole frame?
To be clear, SuperSport rules should stay unchanged, but let us have some latitude with the SB and GT, and Thunderbike rules. There are no bikes being produced so let's start building some!
Fire away, I'm putting my head down now!
BMW F800
http://www.sjbmw.com/default.asp?s=news&nid=280
Aprilia Shiver 750
http://motorcycling.speedtv.com/article/bikes-2011-aprilia-shiver-750-vs-ducati-monster-796/
Wait. You said that only Suzuki and Kawi produce bikes for LW yet in the next sentence you said that Ducati does too.
I have a 1000SS with a single sided swing arm from a 998 and the frame did not need to be cut in 1/2 and the original engine cases can be used. You only need to create a spot for the rear shock linkage.
I have also seen the current Monster model raced successfully this year at Summit Point.
From the factory, the $7995 MRX gives the twins class racer an edge.
At Fischer Motor Company, racing is a driving force behind our efforts. We are a small company, but racing is our background and our passion. We aren't to the point yet of having a factory effort, but we will support racers who take the Fischer MRX to compete against other twins class products from the Japanese manufacturers. Beginning in 2010 we will be supporting efforts in CCS and WERA regional and national rounds throughout the United States. To be considered for sponsorship opportunities, please contact us via email at racing@fischer1.com
Actually I said Ducati does not produce a bike that is competitive- the monster and Hypermotard aren't sportbikes, really. Yeah, they do fit the displacement categories, though. So does a KTM hypermotard. Exactly HOW successfully were these raced?
I didn't know about the Aprilia Shiver or the BMW. Nice but expensive..... So, the 10 year old 748 shouldn't be legal but the new BMW 800 and Aprilia 750 should?
Peter, how exactly did you mount a single sided swingarm without using any part of the 748 / 996 frame? Doesn't that swingarm need to mount to the engine cases AND frame?
Not saying these aren't good options, I'm just genuinely curious as to what the low cost, COMPETITIVE options are.
How about making an ULWSS class to go with the ULWSB class, then let all the air cooled 1000/1100 race the 748 in thunderbike, LWGP?
Gino,
The swingarm fits into the stock engine case and a mount and supports needs to be welded into the frame to accept the 998 shock linkage. Other than that the frame does not need to be modified.
My frame is modified, seat support section removed and aluminum subframe installed, but that was a weight saving effort with no relation to the single sided swing arm.
I have no issue with 748's being included in the LW class I maybe saw 2 all year in Thunderbike.
Peter,
Did you do the swingarm conversion yourself or was this bought this way? Did you also do the 2 to 1 exhaust with that lightweight subframe? How much does your bike weigh?
Peter,
The ones I saw had the "drop" from the 996 / 748 frame welded on to the back of the 900SS frame. The 996 single sided swingarm goes through the engine cases and is braced on either side by the frame- thus making the whole setup stiffer.
Does yours just pivot in the cases and that's the only point of attachment? How does it handle?
I was honestly thinking let us run the 748 in SS trim, no (RS motors). This should be competitive with the built 1200 bimota / buells, the 800 BMW or 750 Aprilla Shiver.
That or let us downsize the 748 to 700CC or bolt a different motor in the frame for SB, GT, and Thunderbike.
Could be a cost effective way to get more COMPETITIVE bikes on the LW grid.
I bought the bike already done. I believe that Donny Unger did the conversion.
I have had to reweld it twice, and for this comming year I will put stronger gussets in to make sure it holds together.
The froma does not come down to the swingarm pivot like the superbikes do. The bike turns in like a Superbike and is very stable mid corner. I weighed the bike at the ROC, and it weighed 365lbs with about 1 gal of gas.
Thanks Peter. So compared to my Duc 800 your bike is actually heavier by a few pounds where mine weighs in at 365lbs with 2 gallons of fuel on the same scale. Comparing the 748 chassis to my 800 chassis after ridden both I would have to say the turn in is about the same but the stability.
Mark,
I know you have a composite fuel tank but do you have wheels or anything else? My 1000 is just a hair under 400lbs....
Guys - I think you are all barking up the wrong tree. LW class rules should not be bastardized to "fit" whatever bike you have that isn't competitive in another class and isn't legal in LW now. We should not use the LW classes to try and create a new low cost class, nor should we be using it to morph into a new "classics" class (AKA - dumping ground for old MW class equipment). Look, I am sorry that the 748 isn't an effective MW bike anymore. Also, no, a pre 1992 CBR600 or FZR600 isn't going to win any MW championships - however, I don't think it is a good thing to transform the LW classes into a classic MW class . Lets just think this through further and let me know where does it stop? If you say 11 year old MW class bikes can step down to LW, then you have to allow the 1999 Yamaha R-6, in 2014 you will have the 2003 R-6 legal - that is way better than any modified LW bike that I can imagine... What about heavyweight and Unlimited class bikes - do we let them in if hey are old enough? Do we end up, at some point, letting Ducati 916's and 996's in (and what if somebody finds an old WSB bike and decides to grid up - talk about opening the wallet)?
If you want to mix and match frames and motors - sorry, that is what the GP classes are for. SS and SB should be production based. If you stray from that model, feel free but you have tlo limit yourself tho the GP classes. This would really open up the pandora's box of spending to the moon rather than going the other way around.
Racing isn't cheap. I really believe that however you write the rules somebody will spend more money than you expect to create a class overdog- just look at the $30,000 Bimota's that you are talking about. All these suggestions do is bend the rules from what has been a pretty stable class to benefit a contingent of riders of older machines. Both CCS and WERA LW class rules- while they have a different overall structure - have been respectively stable for at least 7 years now. I don't think that Mongo will argue the fact that WERA is really designed as a spec SV class; where CCS adopted and embraced a bit less restrictive approach with regard to the air cooled engines. One is not necessarily right, the other is not necessarily wrong, they are just different and gives racers a choice.
The one complaint that keeps coming up that I do understand and sympathise with is a desire to try to find a new "budget" or limited expenditure class. I don't think you should try and get there by messing with rules in any one class, least of all LW. Think about it, LW is the only class where many of us can actually benefit from building a motor or really shaving pounds off a bike. I couldn't ride a 200 bhp open class liter bike effectively - I just don't have the skill. Taking an extra 5 lbs off of that same bike won't make any difference either. However, every improvement I make to my superbike spec Ducati 1000SS does make a difference on the track.
If what we are trying to do is create a budget class or make the economics easier for a new racer, how about if we focus on creating a class were the rules are not about engine displacement, but rather are around restricted spending - I have suggested this many times before but bear with me again. the only way to do this is though a "claimer" class. No equipment limitations - only 2 rules - 1) safety per existing rulebook (safety wire, oil containing lower, etc); and, 2) after every race each contestant in the event can "claim" another rider's bike for some specified amount (for argument sake lets say $2,000.00). Think about it, there is no incentive to spend anything over $2,000.00 as if you do it probably will be claimed. It also would bring out some interesting backyard mechanics. There may be some refinement necessary - but it is simple and focused on the point.
I am sure some will disagree -but - lets focus on what problem you are trying to solve and not make the LW class overall worse off for trying to solve a problem that shouldn't be forced upon us.
George
If I remember correctly, WERA had a "claimer" class, don't remember the specifics but, it was a class in which you had a price limit of $10,000 on your machine and that if someone wanted to buy your bike for $10,000, you had to sell it to them or you were stricken of all points and winnings for the year.
If you want to have an entry level class, then I say make a $5,000 claimer class which will allow one to buy a decent bike for say $3-$3,500 and have $1,500- $2,000 for upgrades and repair parts. Granted cc and air/water will be an issue but I think we can kill a couple of underfilled classes to fit the bill.
Now as for the age of the bike goes, I don't think that there is that much of a difference with the right rider. I was killing it @ RA in '09 with my '01 R6 and have the wood (5) to show for it. I bought it for $3,000 and did the suspension upgrades and dyno tuned it and that was all that was needed other than getting my head out of my a$$ and learning how to ride. BTW, the bike in my avitar is the bike I was running at the time.
George I agree with much of what you have said.
But you have not addressed the point that not many LW eligible bikes are still being made and those that are, are not competitive out of the box.
The Aprilla Shiver 750 or the BMW 800 are $10K and are 95HP water cooled twins with 4 valves per cylinder. These are legal under the current rules. Why not the 10 year old 748 which in SS trim MIGHT make 95HP?
Current rulebook: Twin cylinder, liquid cooled, non-desmodromic valves, up to 800cc
I get what you are saying but I don't think that loosening up the rules for "desmodromic valves" means we have to let 600CC fours into the class. If the rules hadn't evlolved then the 1000DS that you and I ride would not be legal, either.
At some point the rules have to evolve. The LW classes have been modified to absorb the old sportsman classes which, for lack of a better term, HAVE become a dumping ground for older machines that are no longer competitive. The point of club racing is having a class for everyone, isn't it?
Just to be clear I don't have a 748, but would love to build one from ebay parts and be competitive on it.
And I don't think that allowing 748 (non RS models only) in SS trim into LWSB, GTL, and LWGP would change much. Nobody can show up with a 10 year old World Supersport bike and dominate....althought that would be legal in alot of classes and it's not happening now, is it?
Just my $.02 of course.
Aw gino your just jelous
Still think a lightweight class index with a breakout rule. just about all drag racing is done that way and people are still racing .then you can run anything you want
Quote from: Gino230 on November 28, 2010, 10:33:14 AM
George I agree with much of what you have said.
But you have not addressed the point that not many LW eligible bikes are still being made and those that are, are not competitive out of the box.
Gino - It may be circular logic, but, I think that the reason for this is that LW is the best class to "build" a superbike. Very few people are satsified with a LW SS bike because it only tends to be competiive in LWSS and it is completly outclassed in LWSB, LWGP and Thunderbike. I have watched it happen - guy comes out, does well as a yellow plate on a SS legal bike in these 4 classes but when he puts on the white plates he and his bike get smoked by the Superbikes in 3 of his 4 classes so the next year he builds a SB to compete...
I don't agree that LW has absorbed the old Sportsman class - that is Thunderbike. It is an anomoly that they allow LW Formula 40 to run under Thunderbike rather than LW rules - somewhat a mis-titling of the class, but whatever.
I am personally a big fan of the 748's and I wouldn't mind letting 748's into LW only because I really like that bike. However, I really don't think that this will make it any cheaper to win in the class. If they were legal I probably would buy a 748, spend at least as much money as I have into my 1000SS to create something far beyond what you have in mind.
Again - rather than mucking with the LW class, if there is enough interest perhaps CCS could combine a few low-turn out classes and come up with a new "sportsman" class to try and performance index as you suggest? Perhaps we get rid of LWSS entirely (largely has been replaced by ULSB anyways) and all of the HW classes to create enough time in th day for a couple of performance indexed classes.
At least that would be my suggestion.
George
Gino- My Duc 800 has been lightened to the 365# primarily by the use of the carbon tank and the Marchesini forged aluminum wheels. I know it could have been lighter if I had used the Magnesium wheels but at the price I paid to obtain these wheels I just couldn't pass it up. I don't the fairing I have serves the purpose of making it any lighter only because the upper and lower together weighs some 10lbs. The aluminum swingarm will save another 4 lbs when I get around to installing it.
I guess it depends on the region for participation in LW SS. I like the idea of keeping it mainly to have a place for the newcomers to start. I will always recommend a beginner to start in the LW ranks and gor from their. Although the UlSB and the SS is pretty close it does give the SS spec bike a place to race in two classes and be competitive. The older SV seems to have the edge in UL SB when the flatslide carbs are used, unless they are all cheater motors. I do know that there is at least one SV in SS trim that races UL SB and is illegal for the ULSB but legal for SS.
I would like to see some melding of the classes. Right now the RS250 GP bike races in LW GP and is illegal in GT Lights. Makes sense to me because GT lights then allows the RS125 GP bike another place to race. That same RS 250 races HW F40 yet the Duc 748 races in LW F40. The Duc 748 is not allowed in LW GP but the RS250 is allowed to race.
Do we want more of the older bikes a place to race and be somewhat competitive? Do we keep it competitive only for the new machines?
Marc, what is a breakout rule? I don't know much about drag racing. Claiming I get, but that would be a tough sell I think.
In drag racing you have a "dial in". That time is set mainly your statement that your bike/rider combo is "this fast". If you go faster then the term"break-out" is used only because you broke out of the time of your "Dial in". In roadracing you could speculate that a rider/bike combo will do a certain lap and no faster.
It's nice to have more than one class to run. My Duc 800 is competitive in ULSB but because of mods is not legal for SS. My Duc runs well against a SS SV so the Duc in SS trim would get clobbered. I have finally found a second class to run my FZR400 although sorely outmatched in the Ultralight class.
Well I thought you could set a lap index at a certain track like figure the the fastest lightweight bike and back off a second use that no. For the year in that class at that track. So the fastest lightweght last year at jennings is 1.23 add a second to 1.24. Now we all race to a 1.24 lap time if you go faster then a 1.24 then your out. So to win you have to be the first at the line and run over 1.24 haven't worked out the rest of the running order yet the idea is to run anything you want tz250 or gsxr1000 it doesn't matter. Now that I typed it maybe it Won't work.
Yeah, No Marc! Maybe it could be used withn the class something like qualifying.
Ok, racing LW in CCS since 85. LWSS-DB 6? Monoblocks, Superbike spec stuff in Supersport? I dont get it. 1000s in LW? It would be cheaper to buy a AMA Superbike than run LWSS. The DB 6 make everything obsolete, and its not like they are readily available. Hey its a cool bike but should it be legal in SS? CCS please review the LW class.
Is that what you guys said about monoshocks. Sorry had to think of something. The problem in fla is not the bike as much as kevin is a really good rider. And there does not seem to be a lack of them down here.legalize my 748 and that will take the heat off those bimotas lol
Well in this case it's Charlie Mavros. The DB6 is definitely trick, and Duane made a good point on the Jennings forum that they aren't really available. But they were at some point so.....
As always there is going to be someone willing to spend big bucks....what can you do?
what's the difference between a DB6 and a DB5r?
The DB 6 is the 800 with all the trick stuff that is somehow legal for LWSS. The 5 is the 1000. Thats the way I understand it.
I have no idea where you get the 800cc from. Maybe the ministry of misinformation?
Actually both the DB5 and the DB6 use the 1100 engine. Both are legal for LWSS. The DB6 is simply a nekked DB5.
No, the DB6 is also a 1000 (or maybe 1100, the Hypermotard engine.... I'm not sure) but was originally a "naked" bike version of the DB5. I'm not sure the exact differences, but I think that is why Mavros runs that GSXR fairing on his. There's nobody that makes bodywork for the thing.
Unfortunately it fits within the rules so it's legal.
That being said he only went .25 second faster than my 1000 and that is completely SS legal, so maybe it's not as big of an advantage as we think. Charlie is the only one running a Bimota in SS, everyone else we've been referring to here are running Thunderbike or Supersport.
I would like to see the LW rules changed around a bit, maybe limit the displacement to 1000 cc (instead of 1200 big bore kits) The 1200 rule was for Buells, and should really be push rod only.
Quote from: Gino230 on December 08, 2010, 03:09:28 PM
No, the DB6 is also a 1000 (or maybe 1100, the Hypermotard engine.... I'm not sure) but was originally a "naked" bike version of the DB5. I'm not sure the exact differences, but I think that is why Mavros runs that GSXR fairing on his. There's nobody that makes bodywork for the thing.
Unfortunately it fits within the rules so it's legal.
That being said he only went .25 second faster than my 1000 and that is completely SS legal, so maybe it's not as big of an advantage as we think. Charlie is the only one running a Bimota in SS, everyone else we've been referring to here are running Thunderbike or Supersport.
I would like to see the LW rules changed around a bit, maybe limit the displacement to 1000 cc (instead of 1200 big bore kits) The 1200 rule was for Buells, and should really be push rod only.
Be happy you're not trying to race a Bimota on a WERA SUPERSTOCK legal SV....
Iam confused I thought it was 800. Phuck a 1100 now !? whats next 1400s
A Bimota 800 would be nice.
Here's a nice 800 for you. Expensive, but nice:
http://forums.13x.com/showthread.php?t=264560
Excellent 800 and the price is warranted. To build one it will cost more. mine cost me $10K to build and the bottom end was not touched.
I see now the 125GP will be legal in Ultralight.
Now a question; with the 250GP now legal in Thunderbike does this now allow it in LW F40? And will the Thunderbike legalbikes now be legal in the LW GP class?
Not much thunder in a rs 250 but that's ok. You know the best thing about lightweight is it gives eveyone something to jaw about. When is the last time someone bitched about middleweight and itt went for more than a page. Looks like all the lightweight classes are becoming the same. Ditch all the names call lightweight A B C D and be done with it
I get what all your trying to say.If these bikes are too fast in the class then where do they race? Against 600's? If you look at the lap times,yes there fast in our class, if you put them in the 600 class then they will be a few seconds behind.Now if there are some top 600 riders out there and you are on your buells and bimotas with top riders on them-so called lw bikes then youll see they will be 3-5 sec a lap slower.Example at VIR some of the fastest LW bikes that ever raced there have been 1:32-1:34 ,600's do that time in a normal CCS race and then you may not even win the race.At AMA level they go 1:28-1:32
The big air cooled 1000s/1100s/1200s should be called "thunderbikes" and be scored separately from the SV650s, Duc 800s, EX650s. Let them race LWGP, GTLights, and Thunderbike. They have no business in LWSS or LWSB. Also, they need to come up with something so the guys on EX500s, FZR400s, and Honda Hawks can have a place to play. A sportsman class again!
That rule sounds ok.I got a fzr 400 that needs to be raced again,but i dont have room to bring 3 bikes to the track.
If only we were Kings
Does anyone feel like coming forward with HP numbers on some of the bigger Ducatis and Bimotas in CCS lightweight?
I'll start if it means anyhting. My superstock SV has a bone stock motor with a leo pipe and a power commander. I run pump gas and it has 73hp. Right now, the top end is getting freshened up, with new rings, a SS legal valve job, decking the heads, thin head gasket, and degreeing the cams. On pump gas, I should have 78ish HP.
My SBK SV is a 677 and has 87HP on 100 octane non oxygenated fuel.
119 on the 748 and its everything we can do to keep up with markie at the helm 94 and a lot lighteron the 900. Eveyone needs to worry about the 250s the bimotas are old news now
Well I must say that Duane here in Florida has said his SS sv has 84hp. Not stock but built to SS spec. My duc 800 produced 87hp. Duane's sv pulls on me. Gino's duc 1000(stock) produces in the90 hp range and he pulls on me. What I speak of is straight line speed. In Florida I have been able to race with bob Cole on his Nikita and sometimes I beat him. I also race against. Benny on his 900 which has a good amount of trick stuff. I have always admired riders that can take a little and achieve a lot. Ther are many la bikes that have some middleweight speed. Just saying.
Wow, that's a healthy SS SV. 84 HP on a 2nd gen SV is really pushing the stock rods.
I'm assuming that is with MR12 or some other rocket fuel. $25 a gal fuel is not in my budget!
So I noticed some typos after reading my post-such is it when using a phone to post.
I race against Bob on his Bimota and do well at times.
I am not sure if it is MR12 but I think we can safely presume so. On the note of the MR12-You don't think that someone capable of purchasing a Bimota will use pump gas do ya? I hear the MR12 is some cheap HP giving one stock SV rider an additional 10hp on the same dynos those Bimotas are being tested on. I just can't use MR12 with this motor with high compression pistons. It may be better for me to go back to stock pistons and then use MR12.
MRX01 is the high-octane equivalent of MR12 for big comp motors. They also have Oxygenated c16 now. Ya I'm sure if you can take a bike that costs 32 grand and then dump a bunch of cash into a superbike motor for it, the $200-$300 fuel bill for a weekend isn't going to be a big deal.
In response to the original post by Gino, I don't know about the current Monster, but my '08 S2R seems to be a pretty good bike. We actually met down at Daytona at the '09 ROC; maybe you remember me? Yellow bike, yellow plates, #904? Anyway, I think I ran 5th fastest overall in the 4 ltwt races I competed in, so I think the bike has merit... I'm still developing it, and I hope to go much faster on it eventually. Again, I don't know about the current bike. I actually considered buying the new model for a SS legal bike but instead opted for another '08 S2R as I thought it would be better to run the same chassis. (Which, incidentally, I just sold. Work was so slow right after I bought it, I never did a thing to it, and I have some other priorities right now. Oh well.) It sure was fun running my bike naked down at Daytona...
In response to the request for HP #'s, my bike made 95 hp and 67ft/lbs on a Dynojet Dyno. Engine mods consisted of Pistal 11.25 pistons, DP Hypermotard cams, 2mm over intake valves w/ some very light porting by DucShop (Mark Sutton told me that the stock heads flow very well, so they just clean them up a bit), a PowerCommander, open airbox w/ K&N, and a lightened flywheel. That's it; nothing on the bottom end, and I run 93 octane pump gas. I purposely didn't look for more power as I want to be able to run the bike for multiple seasons; when it gets tired, I'll probably bore the cylinders and take it to 1080. As far as chassis mods, I have 996 Showa forks, a Penske double clicker, and Marchesini 5 spoke magnesium hoops off my old 996 (these are dated 1995!!!). The bike weighs around 370 on the ASRA scale with some gas in it, and I don't have a slipper clutch, speed shifter, or even a steering damper, although I'll get around to the latter 2 at some point...
The bike, as it sits, is still better than I am as a rider, so that's why I haven't done more. As I improve, I'll improve the bike. I hope to get way more track time this year as I was only able to run once last year. Oh, and I race Ducatis because I've always liked them - I've owned several in the past, and I still have 4 of them, all 2 valvers. I consider myself very lucky to be able to do so, but, on the other hand, if I had more than 2 brain cells, I'd race an SV for sure.
Whatever. There will always be a better ride out there. It's not the bike that bends, it's the rider. There is no spoon.
Quote from: Farmboy on January 07, 2011, 12:00:16 AM
I don't know about the current Monster
The Penguin racing school recently replaced their fleet of Ducati Supersports with bone stock Monster 696s. From what I heard when I was up at Loudon for the classic Jeff Wood was turning laps in the 1:16 range which would have ben good enough to win several of the Expert LW class races up there. I believe that bike is $7500 new.
In our class it is I think more about the rider then the bike.Well the difference between my SV650 and my duc 1000ds is up to 2 sec difference on most tracks.Can jeff wood jump on my SV and go the same lap time as my DUC? That would be a sight to see.What if Doug Polen jumped on my DUC? He may go 3-4 sec a lap faster.In moto-st when he raced that he was 4 sec faster then the other rider on the same bike.
Jeff is a serious rider I'm sure he tested one before making a decision. If it was a pos he would not have bought them. I've always thougt that the linked suspension would work better. I know there is some guys fooling with monsters out at willow springs.
Here comes the New Ducati RS 1088 2 valve missile .
2 valve 105 HP on a sub 300lbs package.
No more complaining about Bimotas,
check it out
http://londonbikers.com/galleries/image/1593/66012/ducati-1088rs-mcn-carole-nash-london-motorcycle-show-2011-excel
Notice the frame? How about the "P" Look familiar? That's not a Ducati
I'm no longer complaining about Bimotas. I'm going to buy a Ducati 1098, remove the cylinders and put on billet cylinders with cooling fins, then I'm going to run oil thru cyl head jackets with the water pump into a huge oil cooler. It might cost 50 grand to build but the ltwt class is the "ultimate builders class" right? As long as it can survive one sprint race around Daytone during the ROC I'll be happy....
Ok I'm full of shit. I'm not complaining about Bimotas because I'm doing mostly WERA for 2011...
Looks like a new version Pierobon
With the CCS Florida Region round completed in February I can't help but be proud. There were a lot of Expert participants many on those ultrafast Bimotas. Some of the fastest guys were on the Bimota and the Sport classic(or was it the Paul Smart)? Those guys flat out left me in the dust, but there were others on Bimotas that I ended finishing in front of. Mind you I am on a Ultralight legal Duc800. Yes there was a very fast dude on a relatively stock SV that was also up at the front. I had a great time chasing down all those fast guys and girls and I am very satisfied with my finishing results.
Mark
good job Mark! congrats!
tim
Thank you Tim, it was a lot of fun.
Hey Mark, the big bad Bimoto's weren't so bad at Roebling now were they? I laugh in my helmet every time I pass one on my little four thousand dollar SV. Now you on the other hand, I had my hands full with you and your Duc. It was some fun racing though....
You are right Al, but the fastest Bimotas were not there although some fast bikes were. Or more accurately some fast riders were on some very good bikes. It is very satisfying to be able to run on a budget and be competitive, but at $4000 compared to my $10K that I spent in the Duc you have every right to be satisfied.
I am not the fastest guy out there but it was fun messing with all you pesky SV riders. There are some good qualities for the SV but I also know there are some different good qualities that the Duc has. The SV appears to me to be light and nimble but with my Duc another 30# heavier is a cow in coparison. What the Duc 800 does possess is the ability to get out of the corner with it's big torque and fat 180 rear.
As for me I know I have a lot more in the tank. My Duc is capable of much better times there just not with me on it. It was too far away from home and the memories of T5 still linger. I'm not 19 anymore and I must say I am a little wiser.
Mark
Good racing at Jennings this past weekend. It seems as though the lightweight grids were larger than the middleweight grids which is a huge contrast from years gone by.
Al I had a birds eye view of you being pushed wide into T1 and expected you to come by in short order.
I agree! Grids 15 rows deep!
The east side of the paddock looked like a Ducati dealership! :ass:
Got a 3rd 4th & 5th I had a blast! :thumb:
Yup, fun times at Jennings. Nice grids and some great racing!
Marc, the ultra-light race was going to be a battle to the finish but unfortunately I got a little over anxious going into turn-one and got pushed off by Charlie. You pinched me off in turn one to get in behind Charlie at the start and I knew it was going to be a struggle to get back by both of you in six laps so coming out of 14 I had the draft from you two being side-by-side and just went way to hot into one on the outside of Charlie. With you taking the inside line, Charlie turned in so late, I just ran out of track. Stupid me, I should have just braked and tucked back in behind you guys. No big deal, that's racing and I wouldn't have it any other way!!!!
Sorry dude if I piched you too much. i was so wide into T1 I ended up in the pit out lane. I tried to leav enough room on the inside for you but maybe it just wasn't enough. it was quite a bit of wrk to get by Charlie and I did several times only to have him throw it in again. It was a good race regardless. Hope you are uninjured.
Was that you limping around in the grass? Might have been th f40
I was struggling for rear traction on my ducati and was thinking it was a drift bike,so I could not ride it like I know I can.My SV ran great and I did 1.2 sec faster then my lap record on that bike.Overall I was faster on the SV then my DUC,which is not supposed to happen.Even If I put a new rear tire my finishing position would have been the same.I may have gone 1 sec faster,but I needed 3 sec faster.
Mark, what times were you turning?
I did 24's on both bikes,I have gone low 23 on duc before when it was almost stock..Jennings is not my best track.
Times are up on myracingbio. I can see what yoou meant whre you were faster and ore consistent on the SV. was it the tire change you made at Roebling a factor at Jennings? I found the grip to be good and the only exception was in T3 where I tucked the front chasing the Heavyweight F40 guys on the first lap. it was probably my most satisfying race with cosistent lap times. I wasn't the fastest guy out there but it was a very rare expert win for me.
Mark, you should have tried softening up the rear shock a bit for grip. My Buell was the same way there last year. You really have to let the rear squat a lot at Jennings. The big twins have so much torque exiting the tight corners making it tricky at that track. Remember what happened to me last year, You got it all on film. I Soften up the rear, no more problems with grip. I missed you and Darrell being in the mix with me.
i'll try that next time when I am there.I had no problems at carolina with grip,only the long right turn before the last turn and i was running real close to my record with that bike.